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Im fairly certain that what I'm about to say will be disliked by ketamine users and abstainers.
Ketamine is garbage at everything besides temporarily lobotomizing people. It works for it's many uses because it makes the user stupid. It's often given to suicidal people, not because it's a miracle drug, but because it incapacitates them in a safe manner.
That said, it's great at making people too stupid to be able to hurt themselves, most of the time. It's great at numbing psychological pain because the user will be too stupid to conceptualize their own thoughts or realize where they are physically.
It's also hard on the urinary system and has a fleeting high.
If you like ketamine then by all means, you do you. If you may be interested in trying ketamine, become a zombie safely, just don't expect it to cure your depression, woes, or any of your other problems.
Yeah, I'm gonna take the peer reviewed studies results that show that ketamine is quite effective with relieving drug resistant depression over this post of yours...
https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2023/10/ketamine.html
Yeah but I don’t like when peoole see one study and then claim that it’s conclusive. The consensus is that there may there might be something to it being useful for depression, and it should be studied further. No high confidence.
I have no dog in this fight, but any studies done on brain chemistry and psychological effects need to be taken with a grain of salt. We know so little about the brain and consciousness that most of the stuff we're trying and doing are educated guesses.
But your assessment of its efficacy is not contradictory to DontHavePants observation. They didn't say it wasn't effective.
Nothing I said is in any contention with ketamine/depression studies.
This quote from you contradicts what you've just said.
It doesn't. I can speak to it's mode of action without speaking to it's reason of use or efficacy. It's highly effective. It's great at what it's used for. It also temporarily makes the user stupid and incapacitates them.
That isn't it's mode of action, at all.
It also doesn't make you stupid, it is a disassociative anesthetic so you lose touch, to varying degrees, of your senses. At high enough doses even your sense of hearing becomes strange and I would bet if my doc gave me more it would fail almost completely. That's not a place I want to go however.
Despite that, and appearing to be incapable of coordinated movement or speech, the mind is still active. Altered, yes. But active and intact. I am always aware of my partner in the room/bed with me, the dog checking things out, I just choose not to interact with them to continue exploring memories, or alien landscapes, or just turn off my mind, listen to the music, and let the drug work while the most fantastic and surreal images come and go.
I'm here today because of ketamine. Disinformation and pearl clutching threatens to reduce access to it, and could cost lives, speaking only of this one niche use.
I've ingested a ton of ketamine myself, so theres no pearl clutching here. I'll be back tomorrow to continue arguing semantics.
did you use if for medical purposes or fun times?
So you sound like someone with some experience using drugs (particularly those of psychedelic or hallucinatory nature), right?
So you would know that drugs effect everyone differently. Personally, I never abused ketamine, but I have k-holed a handful of times, and my personal experience was that it had a profound effect on me in many ways.
But that's just my personal experience. Nothing more, nothing less.
Anyway, those who know, know MXE (methoxetamine) was way better for that brief period of time before the supply permanently dried up.
You've never abused ketamine, but you've k-holed?
Ummm...?
Again, you're not actually contradicting Pants, you're just rewording and massaging their snark.
You didn't though. You used a blanket statement. As evidenced by your use of the word "everything". Your entire initial comment reads as if it was written in the grip of anti drugs hysteria in the 1950s and shows none of the nuance you're now trying to claim it does.
You're also wrong on its mode of action, so you're not even speaking to that. It doesn't work by making the user "too stupid to conceptualize their own thoughts or realize where they are physically".
He said everything except "temporarily lobotomizing people" which was clearly hyperbole.
He then gave examples where the sedation provided by ketamine can be beneficial.
This guy gets it.
There are so many overly pedantic haters that recently joined Lemmy. Every post now is controversial as fuck judging by the downvoting going on.
I judge my desire to try drugs by how people act when they’re on them. Do they look like they’re having fun at least? Two drugs I’ve never had an interest in:
Ketamine
Nitrous
That's unfortunate. The effects of many drugs can be entirely mental rather than visual, leaving the person looking like they're just laying down with their eyes closed, or staring into space.
Particularly, ketamine, as a dissociative, at higher doses, is entirely in your mind. What a person in that state looks like from the outside is zero indication of what they are experiencing.
Alcohol.
people definitely look like they are having fun drinking
Can confirm that alcohol is fun for as long as you can stand up straight
drinking alone is shite though.
I've just had some pretty good nights in just me, a bottle of wine, and a movie
I guess in the commercials. But we don't actually see them drinking.
I had a lot of fun on the booze last night. my mouth is full of regret and bike today however.
I would add to this that anyone doing ketamine should not do it in the bath, which seems to be what happened here. The same happened to someone I knew, she drowned in the tub.
Any drug close water where you can drown is a recipe for disaster. Someone I knew pop and acid tab at the beach and drown itself.
Yeah, "don't k-hole in the bathtub" seems like pretty good (and hopefully obvious) advice. This seems more like user error than the acute effects of the drug itself.
He didn't die from overdosing on ketamine, because that's nearly impossible.
He drowned.
Agreed. Don't get lobotomized in any body of water.
Or, get this, everyone experiences drugs differently and your bad anecdote is irrelevant next to the mountains of evidence and peer reviewed studies.
Ketamine is definitely up there with 'hip' drugs not worth trying.
Along with MDMA and Xanax.
I don't really respect anyone who does these because they're usually living a lifestyle that leads to nowhere.
Hmmm, I don't know the second one but mdma is great fun. Of course you have to be in a good state of mind before trying, but it's a potent empathogen that has its uses.
One of the most fun nights of my life is when I went to visit a friend at his university, we took some and he immediately ended up with some girl and disappeared on me.
So I decided that I would just wander his campus looking for parties. I took shots with frat boys, danced with some gays guy out dressed in drag, played chess with some guy on the quad (he would have destroyed me even if I was sober), found another friend and went and partied with her and her lesbian friends ("wait you're a lesbian now?" "Maybe not sure") and then made the biggest mistake of my life when I turned down joining them when I was making a hasty exit after I noticed one of the girls was eating the other out right next to me on the couch.
wild 😁 Yea I get how you'd want a do over heheh
My experience is very vanilla coming after yours, but we had some of that and spent the entire night in my last floor apartment just chatting and drinking looking at the sea. It was full moon too. At one point I must have thought it was around midnight, I peeked at the east-facing window in my room and a big ball of fire was burning on the horizon. Time really flew this night...
You'd be shocked by how many very successful and incredibly intelligent people have used drugs (including MDMA). Many still use them regularly. MDMA, in the right setting and in moderation, can (will) be a life-affirming and beautiful experience.
This honestly sounds like something a child would say after having D.A.R.E. in elementary school.
Do you know any of them personally?
I know people like this. Though I should probably define regularly as once every few weeks for k. Probably closer to like 2 to 4 times a year for MDMA. Obviously if you're doing stuff every day then you won't be productive in a job
MDMA not worth it? It's euphoria and love in a pill, not addictive, and quite safe when you do not abuse it. Millions of people use it and have been using it for about half a century and the vast majority of it restricts it to when they're partying with few side effects. I think you misjudge its use a bit.
Yes it can be acutely abused because you're chasing the dragon on nights that you do use it, but that is also a result of its illegal nature and a lack of education.
Of the chemical variants of drugs, I'd say it's probably one of the few that is actually worth it, besides LSD.