this post was submitted on 21 Dec 2023

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Ukrainian army proposal to call up more civilians gets mixed reaction in Kyiv (www.reuters.com)

submitted 2 years ago by throws_lemy@lemmy.nz to c/world@lemmy.world

12 comments fedilink hide all child comments

A Ukrainian army proposal to conscript up to 500,000 more civilians has produced mixed feelings in Kyiv, with many people saying more troops are needed to fight Russia but some suggesting it is pointless unless they get more weapons.

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[–] barsoap@lemm.ee 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Even without weapons more people getting training will be a good thing: First, because then you already have training when weapons become available, at this time Ukraine should leave no training spot unfilled, second, to make it easier to rotate troops in and out from the front, third, well now you have fighting experience which will make you even more effective once weapons arrive.

Side note: This is the first time (to my knowledge) that younger people will be called, IIRC 27 and younger. Average age in the Ukrainian army in 2022 was somewhere between 30 and 35, now it's 43 years, due to volunteers tending older as well as the army needing people who can fight, not people who they first have to teach basics, meaning they very much preferred people who already had served their draft time.

Also this isn't one of those wars where old men talk about glory and young men die. Not on the Ukrainian side, that is.

[–] banneryear1868@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Lots of Ukrainians escaping the draft as well

[–] barsoap@lemm.ee 3 points 2 years ago

Low single-digit percentages is not a lot, all things considered, in particular, it's more than low enough to be able to say, to each of them, "ok if you don't want to fight you're going to be a tank mechanic in the rear": People who don't want to fight are a liability on the front, anyway. There's also plenty of people who first fled to the EU and then turned around and joined the fight once the situation stabilised, once it was clear that Russia couldn't just take over the country.

[–] Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world 9 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It's a fight for survival. Now is not the time to stint. Hang in there, more aid planned for January.

[–] Squizzy@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Not from Russia's United States though.

[–] Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

We will see. I'm not happy with Biden, but I think he could pull it off.

[–] Squizzy@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

He's the lesser of two ancient evils, but far less of an evil

[+] hark@lemmy.world -8 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Why would this be necessary when Russia lost 87% of its military?

[–] wwaxen@lemmy.world 10 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I'm not expecting good faith here, but those reports were for Initial military.

[–] rbesfe@lemmy.ca 3 points 2 years ago

Those losses also include injuries, many of which have since been fixed and returned to the front

[–] hark@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

Thanks for the explanation. I appreciate it instead of people just leaving a downvote without any indication as to why.

[–] 5200@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

87 percent of the troops committed at the start of the invasion. After the cluster fuck became apparent the Orcs did a partial mobilization of primarily the undesirables (ethic minorities) and they have been emptying out their prison systems Putin himself indicated that currently around 600k troops are involved in the conflict. If you do the math on all the numbers the Kremlin has been throwing out over the past year, the 300k Russian casualties that western analysts where reporting seems to be correct.

The highest commander of the Ukranian army has been open that he needs more troops and that the military needs to innovate as the old doctrines are no longer viable.

The Orcs just use penal battalions of people that cost their society money and instead of imprisonment they use them to soak up bullets and bombs for the regular troops. Preventing casualties under trained soldiers and getting rid of undesirables. The DPR and LPR serve a similar role.